How do you design your maps?

[BiggaBullfrog]

I've been asking myself this question recently more and more, especially as I've been going through and updating my personal map database with new maps around the site. I'm really curious how other map designers go about designing their maps; what their process is, where their ideas originate, what part of the map they focus on designing first, etc.

Since I'm asking I'll give my own example. When I first started jumping into what I thought was balanced map design over 10 years ago (holy wow that's a long time ago... also those maps were not balanced at all) the main focus for me was some thematic visual. For example, my first map was Sea Arch, designed around, you guessed it, a sea arch. Other maps that followed almost all had some kind of visual I was going for; a crossroads, a waterfall, a blind hill (because I was taking my driver's test at the time), etc.

(Sea Arch for reference. Ah, those good ol' days when I thought this was totally BoV worthy... The memory makes me smile and cringe all at once.)

Nowadays, my design process has totally changed. While I'll still often have some kind of visual that I'm shooting for (October being my most visually-driven map that I've done in the past while), I've got two larger focal points that drive me when designing. The first and main one is all about the pathing and flow of the map. I go in thinking how I want units to traverse the map, where the action should be taking place, and what decisions players will have to make while developing (along with how easily they can recover with alternate paths).

The second focus I have is the zones on the map, which I feel is in a similar vein to pathing. I try to figure out how the map is sectioned out, where points of interest (height/glyphs/speed lanes) are at, how they're connected/where they're split, and try to find a balance so that each zone can give a usable advantage without being a single power play to victory.

More and more lately I've also been sketching out maps before breaking out the tiles, though the sketches are just me jotting down how I want the paths/zones to fall out, rather than drawing a magnificent lava flow in the shape of an X. I do really enjoy trying to piece maps together with these focuses a lot, and I feel like it gives me something of a style that I like (though I do sometimes worry that a lot of my maps feel samey, as I'm a fan of the ( 8 ) pathing structures (does that make sense to anyone else?)). I also do try to go for an atmospheric "feel" of a map (like my calendar series), but that's less of a focus for me on the whole lately. (I've always struggled with the aesthetics that master map makers just seem to pop out.)

(For funsies, here's an example sketch that I made when starting work on August.)

So, what about you? How do you design your maps?

 

[Sheep]

I’ve been wanting to do a video about this for awhile now but haven’t gotten around to it. Typically I’ll start by looking at what terrain I’ve used recently and try to pick something different. Keep it fresh.

From there I can usually form some sort of vision for the map including my key “set piece”. The set piece is a key visual part of the map (see Trollsford Road), typically in the center where everything is built around that. I build out the SZs next to get an idea of spacing and then path the map from there.

EDIT: VirtualScape is actually a key post build tool for me. Once the map is built I can mess around with the structure of the map more efficiently and pop tiles out from the bottom to use them elsewhere. All done in VS as once I have the core pathing, switching around heights and stuff is usually pretty easily understood.

 

[Sir Heroscape]

For me it's always a theme. My worst maps are typically when I just try to throw something at the wall. Rather, I try to get a theme idea and go from there. Typically I'll go on google images and look up cool fantasy worlds or different landscapes or just ask my kids or wife for a cool map idea. they'll say something like a Lava Pool with melting snow nearby and I'll try to get a visual of what that would look like.

 

[Taeblewalker]

It really depends on the map. In many cases, I start with an idea of what sort of terrain I want to represent, and then build around that idea. An example is Savage Land, a C3G map I designed for casual play. It's supposed to be a fertile jungle valley in Antarctica, so I had snow and glaciers on high ground with swamp and jungle below. Placing a single hex of water inside a ring of lava field looks gorgeous!

 

[superfrog]

Very interesting question, and one I've never thought about much.

Most of my map-making nowadays is done while I'm at work which means I'm using VS only (although my collection is limited enough that many of my maps go beyond my terrain limitations so the VS-only approach is pretty much my only option for many maps I design).

In general, I start each map by laying out the SZ. Often this is flexible and changes as I build the map, but I want to make sure the SZ is sensible. For an RotV map this is often a few grass rows in the back, or perhaps those rock 24 hexes. For a SotM, it's usually a few swamp 7-hexes filled in with swamp water. For a BftU map my default is one SZ sand and one stone (or both sand if it's a 2 BftU map or a BftU/SotM map).

After that I try to lay out my main feature that will span between the SZs. If I'm building a road map I will lay out my desired road shape on level 1. If I have several 24-hex pieces I will try to outline the map shape with these. This is also the point in time where I decide between a map with a central hex and a map with a central 2 hexes (for example, a 7-hex piece has a central hex, and 2 3-hexes slapped together have a central 2 hexes). This is often defined by terrain limits: A 1 BftU map will often have a single central hex because there are 3 dungeon 7-hex pieces available.

After this it's a matter of filling in with whatever I have: add the main level 2 height plateau; put a few glyphs on the board and figure out how to make them balanced distances; place LoS blockers and shadow tiles and battlements. Most of the time I think level 2 should span most of the map so I build that up.

Then level 3 and level 4, I try to save a specific terrain type for these (rock or snow are good candidates). I do think of these together for the most part. Level 4 should ideally sit on top of a larger level 3 island, but there should be some level 3 spaces that don't touch level 4.

Maybe one of these days we can record a 10PU where I draft a map live on VS and we see how it goes

 

[BiggaBullfrog]

Thanks for the responses so far! I'm really enjoying the different approaches (and I've had a lot of fun reading your methods and then going into your map thread and being able to see those patterns).

I've got to say that I'm really jealous of all the designers who do all/most of their work in Virtualscape. I always have trouble envisioning the map as I try to build it in there, so it's never come together like I've wanted. Which also means that unless I'm able to bust out physical tiles I'm usually not doing any designing at all.

I’ve been wanting to do a video about this for awhile now but haven’t gotten around to it.

Ooh, let me know if you do! I would love to see that!

Typically I'll go on google images and look up cool fantasy worlds or different landscapes or just ask my kids or wife for a cool map idea.

Explains a lot, you've got a bunch of picturesque maps!

Placing a single hex of water inside a ring of lava field looks gorgeous!

Very much agreed! That map is incredible!

Maybe one of these days we can record a 10PU where I draft a map live on VS and we see how it goes

Yo I would actually love that.

 

[Typhon2222]

Man, what a great thread. I've enjoyed reading the responses so much — especially because of the differences they reveal in how we go about the process.

Like many of you, I design exclusively in VS. Or rather, designed. I no longer make new maps for posting because I no longer have access to VS. I still play the game, and throw together casual maps for it. But for designing anything balanced and competitive — and especially when designing something that milks the most out of limited terrain sets — I MUST design in VS, because that allows me very easily to pop tiles out from underneath and move them up to the superstructure, as @heroscaper2010 described above. Trying to do that when working with physical tiles is a major major pain. (My signature style is a strong aesthetic preference for BftU as the base set, along with a ferocious impulse to save tiles by propping higher levels up on the bare minimum number of supporting tiles underneath. The latter flows by need from the former, since BftU offers so few tiles.)

But unlike many of you, I sure don't lay out the SZs early. For me, they're usually the last thing to go on. Largely because they're often flexible in terms of whether I use level-1tiles for them, or level-0 (water) instead. If I have leftover water tiles that don't need to go into the main part of the map, I can use them to fill out the SZs, and in the process perhaps take out a few level-1 tiles from the SZ and use them to build up the height of the map.

For me, it's the large 24-hex tiles that determine the fundamental architecture of the map, and are the first thing I start with. I take two of them, and lay them out radially symmetrically to each other in a way that I think is neat. Then I ask whether they'll be on level 1, or instead elevated to level 2. If the latter, I then experiment with various combinations of 7-hex and 3-hex tiles to efficiently prop the big boys up from underneath (which also fills in some additional level-1 space and affects pathing). And then go from there.

So I do not envisage a map — or a central terrain feature — from the start, and then try to realize that image. Instead, my process is totally abstract: I just try to do something interesting with 24-hex tiles as the starting point, and all else flows out and up from there.

Of course, once I have the general shape finished, I do tinker endlessly, shifting small tiles here and there, usually because I want to find even more efficient ways to support the upper levels with fewer lower tiles, so I can free up tiles to extend some other part of the map that needs extending, or because I want to hide ugly tiles (above all, rock) under other tiles.

Fun to think about all this!

 

[Typhon2222]

Any other cartographers feel like sharing?

 

[superfrog]

idk if you've seen this, Typhon, but Bigga and I made this video which dropped today:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0lF_v_-_3g&t=1954s[/ame]

 

[Typhon2222]

idk if you've seen this, Typhon, but Bigga and I made this video which dropped today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0lF_v_-_3g&t=1954s

I watched the last half of it. It was a treat to hear your two voices, and to hear you analyze the map you'd created.

 

[Ulysses]

-----First off, I love this question! As someone who came into the game rather late (2017) it was truly the aesthetics of the terrain and the way it affected the game that really drew me in as someone who hadn’t played much more than your standard family fare of board games prior to Heroscape.

-----Like many a new and zealous ‘Scaper I started by making “what if we put a big island in a lake!?” style maps and the like, but as I acquired more figures and learned more about the game I quickly realized that maps should seek a level of balance.

-----This is what brought me to seek out tournament style maps and what later kindled the desire to take a stab at making some myself. It also actually led me to join Heroscapers instead of just lurking thanks to an ARV contest (please do NOT look up my first entries )!

-----Funny enough, many attempts at tournament style maps later over a few years, I feel like I still start my maps with that ‘what if?’ Sometimes that’s ‘what if I can use both my tundra sets in a really snowy build because it’s like 117F outside in real life and it seems pleasantly distracting’ or other times it’s technical curiosities, like recently for me, ‘what if I wanted to use a Marvel Warehouse Ruin in a bilaterally symmetrical build? What would that look like? What can I mirror that with?’

-----Next is the issue of which sets I feel like will have the pieces I need to technically and aesthetically be able to get the broad strokes in. I very rarely change the terrain decisions made at this step.
Next is the skeleton draft, as I think of it.

-----I start by setting aside my start zones which helps me dictate the general terrain availability, shape, and flow of the map. I use Virtual Scape for all of my initial drafts and will mirror my SZ shape and slide it out until I’m at the general length of map I’m going for, 26-32 inches being typical, though my map length often changes one or two inches during edits.

-----Next I try to establish my initial inspiration then build level 1 out around it. After I play with my first draft in VS long enough that I think I like it, I build it in real life. This makes sure I didn’t miss any supports or build errors and that the aesthetics are as I envisioned.

-----The next stage for me is tinkering with the physical build, moving figures around to check fitting and generally theoryscaping its flow and layout. This kind of begins a VS/physical build dance, where I go back and forth between the two a few times and settle on my first playable draft.
Next we have the playtesting and revision.

-----Then comes the tiresome part where you realize the revision you just made ruined the glyph pathing or some other nonsense (not exclusive to this step). Also, if you’re lucky somewhere in here you’ve been blessed by feedback from other players via the forums or Discord (thank you!), because you’re nearly guaranteed to get good feedback if you’re open to it.

-----I won’t reiterate all the basic aspects of good tournament maps here because there are too many better articles on the subject already available, but I try to heed their counsel as well as I can throughout the process.

-----The final, most excruciating part is my final draft, where I have maybe 4-8 hexes to define the highest ground on the map. This is personally the hardest part. The part where you know you can’t play 20 games on your creation to hone the final tweaks and you’re not even sure if a consensus is possible due to the variance in powers in the game. This is where the community shines by giving cartographers a shot via local tournaments and map review/contest threads.

-----All this said, sometimes you just have to bust out cool terrain pieces you’re fond of, push the limits of your Ikea table (or 1960s card table in my case), and make a big island in a lake!

 

[IAmBatman]

Great thread! I'd love for any of you with competitive mindsets when it comes to map building to join us any time over in the C3G Maps section. We could use more of a braintrust when it comes to evaluating maps for competitive play.

 

[AndreThaGiant]

I've come to learn that a majority of people begin their build with start zones. Apparently I do it backwards, as I start on the middle and work my way out.

 

[Sir Heroscape]

I've come to learn that a majority of people begin their build with start zones. Apparently I do it backwards, as I start on the middle and work my way out.

Worth noting that the ARV has actually done a number of "Map Craft" articles in the past (specifically on Start Zone design in fact) that might be useful to read up on . Linked below...

Map Craft: Map Size in Mapmaking Jun 2017
Map Craft: Startzones Oct 2017
Map Craft: Pathing Jan 2018
Map Craft: 10 Map Building Tips Jul 2018
Map Craft: Pre-set Glyphs Jan 2019

 

[Jen'sEinherjar]

I hate to admit it, but my Heroscape group is made up of babies. I have to make every map completely symmetrical, so nobody cries "my spot on the map was weak!". I dont mind it much, and it has become second nature.

A two person or 2v2 is easy, as is 1v1v1v1.

A 1v1v1 or 1v1v1v1v1v1, I use a hexagon and build from
there.

I know the books always have some neat maps though.

Also, I made a lot of trees, home made.

I try to help out Melee squads as much as possible.

 

[Typhon2222]

Worth noting that the ARV has actually done a number of "Map Craft" articles in the past (specifically on Start Zone design in fact) that might be useful to read up on . Linked below...

Map Craft: Map Size in Mapmaking Jun 2017
Map Craft: Startzones Oct 2017
Map Craft: Pathing Jan 2018
Map Craft: 10 Map Building Tips Jul 2018
Map Craft: Pre-set Glyphs Jan 2019

I just saw — and read — these informative posts. VERY nicely done! Lots of great stuff here.

 

[Shurrig]

Hey all, get ready for a long post! I wanted to give this thread a bump and give some insight to how I design my maps, so here goes nothing:

My process has evolved over the years, as I'm sure it has for every map maker. A little history about me, when I started making competitive maps back in 2017, I would have an idea in my head, tinker on Virtualscape for an hour or so until I liked the way it looked and would post it straight away to Heroscapers. I would hardly ever iterate or play on a map before sharing it, and when I did, I can't say they were often significant enough to make the maps great (see Grounds of Ashra, an ARV approved map that I still like, but could do with about 3 or 4 more drafts IMO). I really wanted to make a lot of maps, which ultimately led to a lack of quality control and burnout on my end. I stopped making maps as often after 2019 and started focusing on other things.

When the announcement came that Avalon Hill was bringing back the game, then Renegade Game Studios picked it up, I was inspired to pick up mapmaking yet again, but this time actually try to make some decent competitive maps. The first thing I like to do is start with a sketch. Let's take a look at my map, Trodden Path, and its very first draft:

My goal of what I want to accomplish with a map varies, whether that's terrain requirement, a theme, main feature, lore-based location, or any combination of the sort. With Trodden Path, my goal was to make a fast-moving map that used only one RotV set (I did cheat with the ruins but oh well, several maps do this). I threw this thing together very quickly and asked for feedback, which I strongly recommend for any beginner mapmaker looking to make competitive style maps. There are plenty of people on the Heroscapers Discord and on the Tournament Map Feedback thread in the forums that are eager to help and give their advice, including myself. Getting someone else's perspective is very helpful for any creative endeavor so do not feel afraid to ask for it! I knew there were problems with this first draft but hearing from others helped me find issues that I did not initially see. From there I got to work:

Okay, I like this little road thing we have going down the middle (looks kind of like a path well-trodden), now we've got a bit of a theme! Let's try to keep that:

That's looking a lot cleaner, but there are still a few important issues here that need to be addressed. Keeping unit info in mind is an invaluable skill for competitive mapmakers to have, as there are units and matchups that can outright break maps. Figures like Raelin, Deathreavers, Gladiatrons, and Zelrig are notorious map breakers, and maps that make it easier for ranged units to shoot down on melee armies uncontested are a big no-no. This is the point where I start asking myself questions like “Can Zelrig target my start zone on turn one?” or “Is Raelin able to perch on height from a safe distance and cover the highest points of a map?” or “can Glads/Rats clog and control crucial parts of the map?” I’m also figuring out the pathing of the map, where the choke points are, and how height interacts with low ground. I enjoy the aesthetics of this version, but I feel as though the LoS blockers are not useful, movement out the left side of the start zone is rough, and you're very prone to a Z-bomb or even a Mimring fire line. That’s a lot of issues just from the eye test, maybe we can fix it without changing a whole lot:

Yeah, something is just not working. Here I’m trying to solve for all the issues I raised previously, but the ruins are still in the way doing basically nothing for me, and I can’t seem to curb that pesky Z-bomb. It’s really starting to bother me. Sometimes you have good idea, but the execution is fundamentally flawed. This doesn't mean the idea is bad, it just means that more purposeful changes need to occur before your map starts to do what you want it to do. So, I take a step back from editing, I playtest the map, and I’m taking mental notes on how it plays instead of looking at a picture of it on my computer. I realize from playtesting that the map feels way too short, that the footprint must change, and that would lead to a cascade of significant edits. However, as a result of these changes, I get a map that solves several of my problems and starts to looks like the final product:

Now we really start to iterate. I go through about 7 or 8 different versions, fixing problems like annoying speedbumps, level 3 height that could result in podding, and general pathing out the start zone. I’m also playing on the map a lot at this point, moving pieces here and there between games to see what I can do to make games more enjoyable. Eventually I get to a version I really like:

This is the version of the map I initially post to Heroscapers, as I feel like it is in a pretty much completed state. From there, I field more feedback from the community. I’m secretly hoping that people tell me it’s perfect and that nothing needs to be changed, that I’ve created the best map ever. This does not happen; in fact, somebody catches something big I’ve overlooked:

Oh dear, the glyph placement creates a choke point on the sides! How could I make such a crucial mistake? I feel like a fool, an utter buffoon, and delete my entire map thread as a result of the embarrassment…

… Nah, I’m just joshing ya. In fact, while solving this, I smoothed out the center a tad, and @superfrog gave me the excellent idea to add some level 4 height on the edges, a feature that I’m very happy with. These minor tweaks not only fix the sides, they give it that little extra oomph that feels like it completes the map. Here is that current final version:

And that’s my process from start to finish! In all, it took me about a month from the time I made my first draft to when I posted my most recent version. I’ll admit, while I like making competitive style maps, I’m mostly making them for my own enjoyment. My goal varies from map to map; however, I always know I want to create maps that can be played at any level of play. I believe taking your map and putting it through the process of iterating, playtesting, and asking for feedback is the best way to make your maps as good as they can be. And with Trodden Path, a map that I’m very content with, it’s possible there may still be a couple issues with it. That’s okay! Most maps are not the platonic ideal of a “great competitive map,” but if you take the time and give yourself room for error, you can come out with a product that you can be proud of.

 

[Myriadite]

This is a very helpful write-up; thanks for sharing! I also have great respect for map builds that are RotV only.

 

[Shurrig]

Appreciate the kind words! RotV maps deserve more love

 

[kolakoski]

Well met!

When I have created a map, it's been for a particular scenario/theme, and is generally free-built on or the day before a particular Gang game day. However, there are now so many wonderful maps on the site that I can generally find one that is suitable, or that I can tweak for a particular aspect of the scenario. This also ensures that there are no anomalies in the map that make it unbalanced or, as happened in some of my earlier maps, unplayable. I loved building with Castle terrain, but hated flying figures' advantage. My solution was to place a Glyph of Rannweig (already covered by a figure) in the tallest tower. The resulting scenario: The Lost City of Ashra, became legendary (at least in my own mind), although chas vehemently objected to the wanton destruction of the Trees.